Emese Árvai-Illés is the singer and songwriter of the band Black Nail Cabaret.
"I usually describe our music as dark pop. We are on the edge of being quite melodic and poppy, but also a bit on the dark side within the electronic music scene."
Emese has always had a craving to perform, it's been her main drive from a very early age.
"I remember when I was four years old and put on my dolls clothes and ran into the living room and started singing, almost yelling, to my parents."
Emese always dreamed of being a singer performing her own songs. But it wasn´t until she was 27 years old that she realized that she actually could sing.
"I never thought I had the voice to do that. I wasn't encouraged back in school, and I didn't find my voice. Everyone was singing in a high register, and I didn't understand why I couldn´t hit those notes. Later I realized that I am an alto."
"I grew up in a culture where doing music as a full-time job was not encouraged, so we always had to have a plan B."
From theatre to Black Nail Cabaret
It all started when Emese joined a horror theatre group. It was mostly movement on stage, with little speaking.
"I enjoyed projecting feelings and emotions to the movement. But at some point, I knew that it was time to do music."
Emese started doing music with Zsófia Tarr who also was a part of the theatre group. Zsófia played the piano and she started to open up to synths while Emese started to put music together at home. Emese started to gain confidence in her voice and the band Black Nail Cabaret was born.
"We started the band together as very good friends, and she is still a very good friend of mine to this day. But she wanted to dive into different styles so she left the band in 2016."
Krisztian Arvai, Emeses partner in music and life, took Zsófia’s place.
"We had been writing songs together for a while and he had been the producer of all our previous albums, so it was obvious that he would step in as a visible member of the band."
Cyberbullying and sexist comments
FinnAgora recently had a photo exhibition called Women Rock, which was about women in the music industry. Emese does not feel like she has experienced prejudice or negative expectations within the music industry based on her gender.
"I think that discrimination and mistreating happens but it´s beyond gender as I see it. I´ve always worked with the most amazing people regardless of gender or country. We were just two human beings creating something together."
Emese has however experienced cyberbullying. Both she and the band have received comments that have been both mean and unhelpful.
"It hits hard, especially on people with low self-esteem. One thing we can do is to realize that it is not the victims' problem or frustration, but the persons´ who are writing the comments. They are trying to project their own frustration on me. I have a certain attitude towards these comments ‘Just wait, I'll show you’."
She has received sexist comments online which were based on her appearance and not the music she makes.
"I try to not pay any attention to it. I don't want it to become my problem by giving it any further thoughts or emotions. I just ignore it, so it doesn't weaken my energy. If someone feels the need to voice their dislike, there is something underneath, not in the artist, but the person."
"It's all about personal taste, it shouldn't be about anything else. If you don't like it, keep scrolling, and if you do, let's connect."
Stereotypes within the music industry
Emese does not think that specific parts of the music industry are considered more of a"man's work", but that women are less well represented in some areas.
"I think that when it comes to producing music there are fewer women than men. Also in electronic music, there are fewer female artists. There exists a stereotype that one could be able to tell if music comes from a woman or a man, that a woman's music is not as rough. But so many women disprove this stereotype."
"People tend to get surprised when they hear a rough beat that tears your face off coming from a woman. I think it is a pretty new thing for women to show their hidden ambitions, power, and aggression in such an open way. This is shocking for people who have grown up to believe that women have a specific role to fill."
She has also noticed that she is affected by stereotypes beyond gender.
"When my last solo was released, some friends of mine questioned how much of the work I've done and how much was Krisztian’s work. They looked surprised when they found out the music came from me as well. I think that was because I'm mostly a singer, and there is a conception that singers only give their voice, maybe the melody and the lyrics, but they do not create the backing tracks."
The mainstream vs. the alternative scene
Emese does not feel like her view on the Hungarian music industry is accurate, since she does not feel like her band has been a part of it.
"We play for a segment of the industry in Hungary, the dark alternative scene. We are an outcast from the mainstream. I think the mainstream music industry in Hungary is a closed circle that we only get a peek of from the outside. I hear stories that there are ways to get in, but you have to make compromises, I’m not sure I want to make those compromises myself. "
"What I see from the mainstream Hungarian music scene is that both genders are well represented. However, based on some of the lyrics and stories from the media, it seems like women are treated more poorly there. The alternative scene is much more accepting and embraces all kinds of freaks and weirdos, and they´re all welcomed regardless of gender."
Treat everybody as people
Emese believes that not only the alternative scene but also her appearance has protected her from receiving strong sexist comments.
"I am a woman but I am not the typical ideal woman of today, in figure or face. And the way I present myself can sometimes appear a bit dominant, and that has been the overall perception of me."
Emese gets shocked and emotional when she thinks about female artists being mistreated.
"I have a friend who is a tattoo artist and she gets sexual pictures sent to her weekly. I received my very first unsolicited image two weeks ago. First I laughed and thought that ‘it has taken some time’, but the picture got stuck in my head and it followed me every day. It was really disturbing."
This reminded Emese about how important it is to be sensitive and not to be judgemental of others, since we cannot know what others are going through.
"It can be anything, like victim-blaming, the mistreatment of the LGBTQ+ community, racism, or religious hate speech. We don´t know what it feels like to be in their shoes when they are hurt on a daily or weekly basis."
At the same time, Emese does not want to fall off the other side of the horse and is a bit careful with political correctness.
"One should not seek validation only for your frustration. Of course, we need to acknowledge everyone's emotions, but one should not take advantage of that."
"Treat everybody as people for god's sake, and do not categorize them because of gender, skin color, religion, or whatever. When it comes to artistry, this all shouldn’t matter. Do not lift me because I´m a mistreated woman, but because I am an interesting artist. I don´t look at the scene as female or male, to me they are artists. Every person regardless of gender can be interesting as an artist."
Gender fluidity
Emese feels like the image of the band changed a lot when the members of the band changed.
"When we started the band with Zsófia, we were getting more attention. It was a different atmosphere with two girls on stage, the speed exposure we were getting seemed to slow down after we became a boy and a girl duo."
"The project became unisex in my mind, it moved from appearance to the music, it felt more mature and it changed my attitude towards the band completely."
Emese thinks that gender roles and expressions are more fluid for her.
"Sometimes I feel like I´m going out in a man's suit because I feel strongly connected to my male idols, but another day I might be more connected to my female side. And I think that it's amazing to live in a time where you can play out both. It is artistry and you are allowed to live out your artistry in full freedom."
A big part of Emese’s artistry is costumes and her stage appearance. She has created both her own costumes and accessories, but also collaborated with fashion designers. Her favorite accessories are armors and masks.
"Before doing a show, I get a feeling of it and a persona emerges. I plan the costumes around that feeling and I can spend months on that when I know something big is coming up."
Emese gets a lot of her inspiration for costumes from drag. She is a huge fan of Drag queens, especially RuPaul, the mother of Drag, and the Drag queens competing in his Show RuPaul's Drag Race.
"These artists teach me about my femininity. It's mind-blowing, that a man in a woman's dress with the most beautiful makeup is teaching me about my femininity, artistry, style, and how to present myself."
Women in the music industry
Emese does not like to comment on what good things there are about being a woman in the music industry.
" I do wonder what I would have achieved in an alternate universe doing the same thing as I do as a man. But that we will never know. The question is similar to when people ask me "how does it feel like hearing with one ear?" because I'm half deaf. I just answer that I don´t know, that I´ve never heard the stereo. This is the way I was born, this is the body I got, this is what I have to work with."
Emese does not think that women should focus on stories about how difficult it can be for women in the music industry, or be scared off by horror stories of discrimination.
"We don't have to worry about what is in others' minds, we just have to worry about what we do, and what we give to this world. We should focus on the journey, not the blockage. There will be hindrances wherever you go, even if you would go to a mountain to live in a monastery, you would find your hindrances there. There will be blocks and anxiety wherever you go, we just take the suffering with us. You might just do whatever you want to do."
Emese wants to advise women who want to work in the music industry to educate themselves and to start as early as the drive comes.
"Do not hesitate for one minute, if you work on it hard you might be able to do that for a living. For me living half in plan B and half in plan A, it's the consequence of my mindset, the way I thought about it from a very early age. So if there would have been someone to tell me ‘you can pursue a music career’, I might have just worked my ass off from the age of ten.”
Scandinavian influences
Emese is quite familiar with Finland, even if she has never visited it herself.
"My father has been to Finland many times since he works in transport, and I also have many friends and colleagues from there. But I have never been there myself."
Emese knows a lot about Finnish music too. She listened to HIM when she was younger and is familiar with Finnish metal bands, like Apocalyptica and Nightwish.
"Finnish metal is world-famous, but I do not listen to that type of music much, I was always more into electronic music. Huoratron is an amazing talent in the field of electronic music. I think that it is not only Finland, but whatever comes from Scandinavia that has a great sound. I have to add Röyksopp, they´re Norwegian, and just like Huoratron, the mixes sound fantastic. I am not sure what is in the air that makes the mixes so good, but we use a lot of Scandinavian musicians as references when it comes to mixing."
Black Nail Cabaret has planned to play in Finland too.
"I just love the Scandinavian region, amazing people, and fantastic landscape. I'd love to visit if I ever get a chance. But we are going pretty close, we are hoping that we´re able to play in Denmark in November. There are so many countries we haven't been to and would love to visit, and Finland is definitely one of them. I think that there are some great festivals for our type of music, we might be a good match."
The pandemic has changed a lot about the music industry, especially about touring. However, Emese still has a positive mindset.
"There might be more administration when you want to travel, more paperwork, and higher costs. There are many things you have to calculate now that you didn't have to do before. You have to accept the change. This is a really good learning period. For me, an over-planner, I just have to learn to be flexible."
Who?
Career:
Singer and songwriter of dark pop duo Black Nail Cabaret since 2008 - https://blacknailcabaret.bandcamp.com/
As a solo artist: Breakaway, EP (2012) and Two, EP (2017) https://emke.bandcamp.com/album/two
Vocalist and/or lyricist for different projects:
Architect (DE) - Mine, album (2013), Planetdamage (HU) - Angst, song (2016), Junksista (DE) - Freak At Heart, song (2018), Attrition (UK) - The Great Derailer, song (2020), SOMAN - C.O.D.E., song (2020), Fix8:Sëd8 (DE) - tREMORs, song (2021)
Hobbies: Reading, animals (cats especially), traveling & hiking, fitness & yoga (more a must than a hobby).
Inspirational artists: Björk, Jehnny Beth, Anni Lennox, Siouxsie Sioux, Zola Jesus, Gazelle Twin, Madonna, Ellen Allian DJ, David Bowie, RuPaul, Violet Chachki, Sasha Velour, Crystal Methyd.
“These are my inspirations when I´m having a hard time as an artist, when I can't find confidence in myself. I think of these artists, sometimes even on a daily basis when we are touring.”
Mirjam Ekelund
FinnAgora
Picture by: A L PIX https://m.facebook.com/alpixphotos/